[Alt-photo] cyanotype paper

Marek Matusz marekmatusz at hotmail.com
Tue Dec 5 20:50:49 UTC 2017


Back to silica patent. Chris did you read it? That would be a great to try in a class settings as one of the variants

The paper could be precoAted or silica mixed in solution
Marek



Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 5, 2017, at 11:38 AM, Eddy Willems via Alt-photo-process-list <alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org<mailto:alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org>> wrote:

a lot of years ago we made a cyanotype on fabrics, we just emersed the fabric in the solution, wring it and let it dry in the dark, we exposed under the sun, washed in running water, results where beautiful


Op 5/12/17 om 03:25 schreef Fernando Cruz via Alt-photo-process-list:
Hello fellow forum members, I live in Colombia and I've followed this forum for a long time now. I bought Christina's first book on gum bichromate when it came out, I have other books but hers is the one I consult most often. In her second book Christina included some gum prints by Servane Aubineau who has taken workshops with me.

I am now working with a student producing cyanotypes of yarumo leaves on a 150x150 cm canvas, exposing the canvas with the leaves on top, I'm not yet sure if we'll expose it in daylight or with the UV lamp we use for screen printing. Any suggestions?

My second question is on how to coat a surface area of this size - do I use Christina's 1x1 mix and what canvas types are recommended?

Thank you for your advice.

Fernando Cruz
3108686025

Cr 14 # 75-29
Bogotá
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El 4/12/2017, a las 10:11 a.m., Marek Matusz via Alt-photo-process-list <alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org<mailto:alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org>> escribió:

I second Chris here. Thanks for posting
Marek

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 4, 2017, at 5:55 AM, Christina Z. Anderson via Alt-photo-process-list <alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org<mailto:alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org><mailto:alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org>> wrote:

Victor,

There is never any inappropriate joining of a conversation on this list. In fact the opposite: we wish that those who never post and never share but just lurk would join the conversation!

Thanks so much for the patents in the Dropbox link. It is so much easier to share them like this than to search!

Chris

On Dec 3, 2017, at 3:33 PM, Victor Malakhov via Alt-photo-process-list <alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org<mailto:alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org><mailto:alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org>> wrote:

Hey,

sorry for perhaps inappropriate joining the conversation, I am new in this mailing list :)

I've most probably read the same U.S. patents as you Marek and I forgot the link to the source as well. But luckily I've saved some pdf-copies on my PC. Here is a short-living upload to the Dropbox, so you can download them for your use:
https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.dropbox.com%2Fsh%2Fy0cfk37tiedizn3%2FAADpBJxkjVaKtk73osa8QGfPa%3Fdl%3D0&data=02%7C01%7Cmarekmatusz%40hotmail.com%7Ce6e6d7ee94cd4686ed6c08d53b1ea40e%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636479925150663954&sdata=D7QV1srZmXnGumfnKOktncE5PXkOzKwSPNRoCCAzFAo%3D&reserved=0

I hope it is what you are looking for!
Best,
Victor

Feels like I remember reading in some older patents about the use
of fumed silica for the production of blueprint paper. This was
aimed at increased print density. I won’t be able to look for the reference for a while

But maybe my memory is playing tricks on me
Marek

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 3, 2017, at 10:55 AM, Christina Z. Anderson via
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Thanks, Bob! I will go check my Kosar out now.
Chris

On Dec 3, 2017, at 10:10 AM, bobkiss
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<bobkiss at caribsurf.com<mailto:bobkiss at caribsurf.com><mailto:bobkiss at caribsurf.com><mailto:bobkiss at caribsurf.com>> wrote:

DEAR CHRIS,

Recently, I dug back into my 1970s edition of Kosar and it was
even mentioned there that one could actually mix some fumed silica
into the coating solution and that it would increase Dmax.  If you
are interested I could try to find the page # and edition # of my
oooooooooooooooooooooold text book.

                       CHEERS!
                                     BOB

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To: "Richard Sullivan"
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Cc:
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Sent: Sunday, December 3, 2017 11:02:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Alt-photo] cyanotype paper

Dick,

I have seen that silver nitrate formula often: Wall, Brown’s Ferric
and Heliographic Processes, Hoppé, Photographic News... One calls it
“Imitation Platinotype.” I have lots of silver nitrate lying around
from salted paper and planned on trying it one of these days.

Silica seems to be a holy grail with pt/pd. Am I right in that
assessment? I have never used it. I read on your website that you
suggest it deals with the buffering in the paper, or does it attract
humidity so the paper remains moist or what?  What exactly is its role in pt/pd?

I tried to find the pH of fumed silica and it seems it might be on
the acid side. If so, that would be good for cyanotype and its problem with alkaline papers.

Just thinking aloud here, trying to see if its pH or its humidity
effects are what are improving the cyanotype process for you.

Ware says he has not found humidity to be a factor in cyanotype as
in other processes (p. 181 Cyanomicon II) and so far that has been
my case, too, which, of course, makes it quite user-friendly for a Montana climate.

But the ubiquitous calcium carbonate buffering is such a PIMA with
cyanotype and if silica did, in fact, improve that, it’d be a great ingredient to have on hand.

Chris

On Dec 2, 2017, at 10:01 AM, Richard Sullivan
<sullivan8486 at gmail.com<mailto:sullivan8486 at gmail.com><mailto:sullivan8486 at gmail.com><mailto:sullivan8486 at gmail.com>> wrote:

A quick add-on

When coating with fumed silica the silica seems to take over. When
I was first testing it with PD/PT, I asked Dana what was in his
knowledge the worst paper to use for PD/PT. He said without a doubt
Lannaquerell. Gordon mark and I grabbed a few sheets and the results
were stunning, nice prints on the coated side and crap on the uncoated silica side.

--Dick

On Sat, Dec 2, 2017 at 9:56 AM, Richard Sullivan
<sullivan8486 at gmail.com<mailto:sullivan8486 at gmail.com><mailto:sullivan8486 at gmail.com><mailto:sullivan8486 at gmail.com>
<mailto:sullivan8486 at gmail.com>> wrote:
From an unknown source and from my archives. I found thus about 40 years ago. Never tried it.

">> To Color Blue Prints Black.
— To get the desired color, bathe the
print in distilled water and immerse in a 2 per cent, nitrate of silver
solution. After bleaching of the picture, wash again in distilled water,
dry and expose to ammonia vapors. A short exposure and subsequent
development with oxalate of iron will produce a good black silver
picture.

Paper be damned. A few years ago my assistant Madelyn Willis (pic
below) and I were exploring fumed silica and cyans.

Below on the left (her right) is a fumed silica coated print, the left one is non-silica coated.

We used the same mix for both and did our best to coate, expose, etc the same for both.

The results were even more stunning when we used something we called
SuperBlue from a 1950's formula for commercial BP paper.

As for details check Advanced patent search and search for "Cyanotype blueprint Jahoda."

https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2Fadvanced_patent_search&data=02%7C01%7Cmarekmatusz%40hotmail.com%7Cb27f8d72657347f47de308d53a7f66cc%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636479241206163817&sdata=lxpTiLeLJsw0hwtBOJurEQYNz4msk6RJLQFN8pTGzZo%3D&reserved=0
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Of further interest Patent No.:

2,237,084

Also note that guanidine ferric oxalate was the iron salt of choice
in the latter period of the blueprint.

How to make:

2265934 A

(Originally derived from guano off islands near Chile. Known around here as batsh*t ferric oxalate.)

I have some guanidine carbonate here.

--Dick



<image.jpeg>


On Sat, Dec 2, 2017 at 9:12 AM, Christina Z. Anderson via
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<mailto:alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org>> wrote:
Dear Alberto,

You started me on this trend a long time ago when you posted the
topic of bleeding and information you had found in patents on the
list. Since then I have changed the typical 20%/8% you see quoted in
books, including my own, to a minimum of 20%/10% to make sure the
ratio is no greater than 2:1 (I know you had discussed molar amounts
and yours was 18/8). The sky didn’t fall in.

Then through my research into formulas I found that they were so
completely all over the board that I started testing a 4:1 FAC:PF to
1:4 FAC:PF and was surprised how little difference it makes. You
still get a print. However, the speed is slower. But the color is
more turquoise and less navy (goes more green than red) and it is much smoother.

When I began testing papers for my upcoming cyanotype intensive
class spring semester, since I started with the 10/10 I just kept
on, to keep apples to apples. When I narrow down to a few select
papers I’ll go back to the 20/10 to see if the speed increase is
worth it over the smoothness and color I prefer.

When I was using the 20/8 I was also often using 2A:1B or 40:8! No
wonder I had bleeding and it was you, Alberto, who saved the day!

Chris

PS Another paper I have had great luck with is Clearprint 1020H.
100% cotton. It amounts to about 20¢ for a 9x12! This and Canson
U-Sketch/Crob Art have to be about the cheapest (14¢ a 9x12) but the
Clearprint specifies cotton and archival and the Canson does not say
what the paper is made of. I do tape the paper down when coating. I
much prefer it to the lighter weight 100H Clearprint but the lighter
weight is conveniently often sold in small pads.

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On Dec 2, 2017, at 12:33 AM, Alberto Novo
<alt.list at albertonovo.it<mailto:alt.list at albertonovo.it><mailto:alt.list at albertonovo.it><mailto:alt.list at albertonovo.it>
<mailto:alt.list at albertonovo.it>> wrote:


With vinegar and citric it leans turquoise. With sulfamic it leans
purple. Caveat: I am using classic cyanotype at only a 10% ferric
ammonium citrate/10% potassium ferricyanide so YRMV, but UVBL
exposures are 12-19 minutes with acid development.

Hi Chris,
I see that you have switched to a greater amount of ferricyanide, like we discussed time ago.
Hence, there are some benefits, isnt'it?

Alberto

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--

--

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Victor Malakhov

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